Get Your Gun and Aim

you wrote "…companies that may or may not be well capitalized are getting flushed." nope, companies that are not well capitalized are getting flushed. should've been flushed months ago. can you name one well capitalized firm that has been flushed? the little people at lehman, bear, et al, the secretaries, office managers, food service people, were served poorly by the stupid, greedy upper management, who refused to recognize reality. just like the shareholders. somehow, the winners (credit suisse, morgan, goldman, and in their own way, merrill) knew when to sell. or when to get your ex-ceo to be treasury secretary.

Tobias - how will loan values stablize when you lend people 125% of the houses worth, they've paid no principal on it for 5 years and most of the appraisals were flawed? No bailout, let the bankers and politicians lose their jobs and feel our pain. Moody's and the others that were rating the credit have admitted that their models were flawed - they told management and management decided to ignore this fact. Now the number crunchers have figured out (along with all of us) that what is on the books isn't really worth what it says. So don't ask me to pay what is on the books and saddle me with 700 billion in new taxes!

market down 777 pts., let's see with all the brain trusts we have in washington d.c,, people losing thousands in their 401's, pensions, savings, main street is the one losing, while congress plays politics i want to see some of these people in jail who saw this coming, and i want some of them to be the low lifes in politics, those who knew and created this debacle then again, imo, this is a systemically and methodically planned downfall against the united states by the power packed rich give me a $5.00 box on 777

can we do anything to prevent losing all our savings?

All of a sudden, $700 Billion doesn't sound like a whole lot of money.

LETS LOOK AT THE FACTS AT HAND. SINCE THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY HAS BEEN IN CONTROLL OF BOTH HOUSES OF CONGRESS(LESS THAN 2 YEARS), THE COST OF GAS AND OIL HAS DOUBLED, MORE PEOPLE ARE OUT OF WORK, THEY ARE TRYING TO FORCE US TO ACCEPT ILLEAGAL ALIENS INTO OUR COUNTRY AND ECONOMIC SYSTEM AND PAY FOR THEIR MEDICAL, SCHOOLS, AND SOCIAL SERVICES. THE VALUE OF OUR PERSONAL PROPERTY IS WAY DOWN, THE DOLLAR HAS BEEN SERIOUSLY ERRODED ON THE WORLD MARKET, THEY HAVE ALLOWED THE MOST RECENT RIP OFF 'REVERSE MORTGAGES' AND THAT WAS AFTER THE 'AJUSTABLE RATE MORTGAGE' THEFT, WHICH DOES NOTHING MORE THAN STEAL OLD PEOPLES RESIDENCES AND DEPRIVES INHERITANCES FOR THEIR FAMILIES THAT ARE LEFT ALL THE TIME WHILE USING ACTORS FACES THAT WE KNOW WHO ARE MILLIONAIRES IN THEIR OWN RITE TO LEAD THE PEOPLE DOWN A YELLOW BRICK ROAD OF FALSEHOOD. NOW OUR GOVERNMENT IS TAKING OVER THE MAJOR ASSETS OF CORPORATIONS AND SEASING ALL FUNDS, INCLUDING THAT OF THE SAVINGS PLANS THAT THE EMPLOYEE'S HAVE INVESTED IN TO BE GIVEN OVER TO THE COMPANIES' 'CREDITORS', SOUNDS LIKE NAZISM AND COMMUNISM TO ME! AND ALL WE DO IS KEEP ON ELECTING THE SAME PEOPLE BACK TO OFFICE AROUND THE COUNTRY AT EVERY LEVEL. FEW OF WHICH HAS KEPT THE PROMISES THAT THEY MADE TO GET THEM THERE. ESPECIALLY ON A PARTY LEVEL, WHICH NONE OF THEM HAVE BEEN KEPT AT ALL. INSTEAD OF VOTING THEMSELVES PAY RAISES(OF CORSE YOU HAVE FORGOTTEN ABOUT THAT BECAUSE IT HAS BEEN SO LONG AGO AND WILL NOT TAKE EFFECT UNTILL JANUARY 2009 WHEN THE NEW CONGRESS IS SEATED, ANOTHER DEMOCRATIC PARTY ITEM) WHY DON'T THEY TRY SOMETHING TOTALLY DIFFERENT, VOTE THEMSELVES A 'DECREASE IN PAY'. INSTEAD OF RAISING TAXES YET AGAIN, WHY DON'T THEY 'LOWER' SPENDING, LIKE ALL THE PORK BARRELL PROJECTS THAT THEY ARE GOOD AT MAKING SURE GETS AWARDED AT THEIR DISTRICT/STATE SO THAT THEY CAN POINT AT IT AND SAY 'LOOK WHAT I DID FOR YOU, NOW VOTE FOR ME AND RE-ELECT ME TO OFFICE SO THAT I CAN CONTINUE(GETTING INTO YOUR WALLETS AND PURSES) AND LIKE LEMMINGS, WE FALL FOR THEIR CARRISMA AND RE-ELECT THEM. A COMMON THREAD THAT RUNS THROUGH MANY IS 'I DON'T CARE HOW MUCH THEY STEAL FOR THEMSELVES, AS LONG AS THEY TAKE CARE OF ME FIRST' ALL ALONG NEVER REALIZING THAT THEY THEMSELVES ARE THE VERY ONES THAT THE MONEY IS BEING STOLLEN FROM. FOR A NATION THAT WAS FOUNDED ON 'TAXATION WITHOUT REPRESENTATION' WE ARE FAR FROM THAT AS OUR SO CALLED REPRESENTATIVES DO NOT REALLY CARE WHAT THE CONSTITUENTS WANT THEM TO DO JUST AS LONG AS THEY LOOK GOOD AND KEEP GETTING RE-ELECTED SO THEY CAN EXTORT MORE FROM US. I CAN IMMAGINE AFTER THESE COMMENTS APPEAR THAT I WILL BE PUT ON SOME KIND OF WATCH LIST OR WHATEVER, KIND OF LIKE HOW THE SECRET SERVICE CAME IN AT THE REPUBLICAN NATIONAL CONVENTION RECENTLY TO THE MORE THAN 600 RON PAUL DELAGATES THAT WERE LEAGALLY ELECTED AND ILLEAGALLY CONFISCATED ALL THE RON PAUL SIGNAGE AND BUTTONS, BECAUSE IT WENT AGAINST 'THE MAN' WHO THE CHIEF REPUBLICANS WANTED TO RUN FOR OFFICE. THIS IS A CONCEPT THAT ALL PARTIES HAVE DONE FOR YEARS. WAKE UP AMERICANS!

I have heard no one address this question - what were the members of congress doing to get money from the housing giants, Fannie and Freddie? I don't understand why they were getting money. I also was disappointed in Bush and I want to hear from Chris Cox. I want names, I want acountability.

"Manhattan has been somewhat shielded from the economic fallout but no longer." boooo-fing-whooooo. Oh no, you poor babies I feel so sorry for you. You cause this MESS and now want me to shed a tear for you. Everywhere else had been feeling it for years now. Welcome back to the REAL WORLD! I hope this bailout of you f-ups doesnt go through so you know what you did.

My grandfather used to be the Sheriff of Yuma, Az. He was there during the depression of the 1930's. One day I asked him why the depression happened. He said "always wait til the dust settles. Then you'll see the why of things." In other words, just wait awhile and you'll see who or what benefits from any event, especially chaotic events. If I were Bush, either Bush, and I wanted to expedite what senior said is "the coming one world order", what better way to implement the "plan" than through a world-wide depression started by the collapse of the financial complex. Of the few constitutional rights We the People have left, how easy will it be to take those as well, when people are willing to do anything for a loaf of bread? I personally believe our financial circumstances are contrived, manipulated and were planned long before now. Not unlike the thousands of pages of the PATRIOT Act being ready for implementation days after 9/11, or the real reason why we are in Iraq (it has nothing to do with weapons of mass destruction), the collapse of Wall Street is a smoke screen for what's really going on and that is usurpation through instability and chaos. When the dust settles, just see who benefits from all this. And I guarantee you, it won't be you or me. James Chappell

Guns and Ammo are one solution but not feasable ( too many targets ). Vote NONE OF THE ABOVE! That gets all the culprits and is much cheaper. for those of you who believe that 700 billion will do the job: Rule of thumb for government estimates. Double the estimate for the first six months, triple for the next six month period, 33.5 percent for each following six month periods attributed to unforeseen inflation adjustments.But we are already at 1.8 trillion.Know when to holdem know when to foldem know when to walk away!NO BAILOUT!

As a southerner who was never reconstructed, I say no more socialism, no bailout. Its time to withdraw from the Union and reestablish the original Consititution Of "We The People".

attn; director of the f.b.i,,,the american taxpayer,your employer,have a federal fraud/corruption/collusion case for your dept. to focus on.we are all aware of the involved,namely politicians @ wallstreet ceo fatcats who have taken advantage of the american taxpayor for many years. they must be held accountable,and prosecuted for these many illegal actions against this country...your current investigation must broaden to include all involved, regardless of status or position....................WE THE PEOPLE......... INSIST OUR RIGHTS AND INTREST BE UP HELD. WE ASK THAT YOU INCREASE INVESTIGATIONS INTO THIS THIEVING BAILOUT OF THE FILTHY RICH AND THOSE ACT AS IF THEY ARE ABOVE THE LAW.WE ARE PROUDLY BEHIND YOU IN THIS MATTER. GIT ER DONE , THANKYOU ....JOE TAXPAYOR VOTER

Boy, I do understand about the effect on workers in NY. However, the seeds of this were laid years ago with the advent and goal of globalizing, that is all this is about... first the NAU, (canada just announced they are in the same boat). What should have made you suspicious is the wall street controllers knew these thing early on and waited until one week before they needed this to come to congress. At least that is what everyone is saying and we don't believe half of what we hear anymore. For instance, Bank of America is pulling and stashing all their assets out of their banks becuase they heard the bail out was not going to go through, SO THEY ARE CREATING A BOGUS CASH SHORTAGE TO HARM THE AMERICAN PEOPLE IN RETALIATION FOR NOT BAILING THEM OUT. So that my friends, IS CRIMINAL, SHOULD BE INVESTIGATED AND PROSECUTED, IF THAT IS THE CASE. SUNDAY BEFORE LAST, LEHMAN BROS ON SUNDAY NIGHT NY TIME, BORROWED $350 MILLION DOLLARS FROM A GERMAN BANK MONDAY MORNING GERMANY TIME..... LEHMANS KEPT THE MONEY AND THEN HAD THE NERVE TO PLACE THE NEW LOAN INTO THE BAIL OUT AND THEY DID ALL THIS KNOWING FULL WELL THEY WERE GOING DOWN..... THEY SCAMMED THAT POOR GERMAN BANK AND THE US TAXPAYER. What is worse, we don't know how many bail outs they did this felony scam with prior to bail out and how much cash they stole from the banks and taxpayers. THEY ALL NEED TO GOT TO JAIL AS WELL AS ANYONE WHO VOTES FOR THIS THING IN CONGRESS. Now do you understand why we don't care if we crash as long as it takes those bankers down with us...we are sick and tired of this garbage of either depressions or wars... these people know no peace in life, they need to take this whole choas and drama they create to some other country and get the hell out of ours. Take the fox,Paulson, leave the chicken coup (banks) with us. NO more foxes guarding our chicken coups.

Everyone needs to stop a minute or so and listen. This predicament is based on falling home values. The mess will continue until the values stabilize Stabilizing the values is priority one and was done before with the RTC. If you stabilitze the home values, the foreclosures will stabilize and the loans and collateral problems will stabilize. When the loans and collateral issues stabilize, the markets will stabilize. Get focused on what matters. The middle class taxpayer/homeowner. Fix that first and then you can worry about blame and who ought to pay for what. If you don't then YOU are to blame.

It's hard to top all my countrymen's (ladies too) comments on this mess, but the ideas I like best are NO BAILOUT; find the people who need to go to jail and send them there. Preferably to a jail where they have to make their own living. Kevin makes a good point and having worked on wall street he knows other folks more credible can take the places of the people unfit for the trust. In fact this works in all business and personal relationships; there is always someone that can take your place if an individual doesn't merit the position they have. Fiat money into our system will only exacerbate the problem. Our leaders really need to read this stuff. What does it take, open revolt?

Ok, the eagle has landed once again due to the "federal reserve". When the U.S. lost its ability to coin money and turned its sovernity over to a private co. it set the stage for these depressions. We do not have real money. The rest of the problem is amply discussed by others. Prepare for the comming depression and world war that will follow. The event we are witnessing is a logical outcome of internationl one world planning and collusion. The people loose again. They loose their "money", homes, livelyhoods, and they fight the wars that come as a result of this kind of economic repression and corrersion. The world will sink into depression, the rich will profit and the common man will suffer. This time there may not be a new day to follow the bad era we are entering. Armegeddon may be just arround the corner!

Since everything is broken anyway, let's go for the full crash and burn. I feel sorry for those at the bottom of the totem pole that will be affected (like me), but a bailout is unacceptable. I only wish the greedy bankers, CEOs, finance guys, congressmen, etc. would feel ashamed of what they caused. But they won't; they never do. American greed at its finest.

I watched the President's speech tonight. Let me see if I have this straight. This crisis on Wall Street has been building for a long time (prior to the Bush administration). Just six months ago everybody said that Wall Street was fundamentally sound. Now it isn't. This was caused by the "sub-prime mess" which translates to a bunch of bankers making loans to be people who couldn't afford them and were stupid enough to sign up for them anyway. Now the government wants to use $700 billion (?) of the taxpayer's money they don't have to buy these bad loans, get them off the banks balance sheet, so the bankers can go back to what they were doing before. The government is betting that we can hold these bad mortgages to maturity and make a profit, even though nobody can tell what the real price of these bad loans are today. Did I miss anything?

A lot of people need to go to jail, including members of Congress.

So the big press machine goes into overdrive to try and scare us into another foolish mistake by bailing out these bums on Wall Street. As a former employee on that street, I feel for those that support these big institutions that caused this mess. However, I have lost over 30% on all my investments this year, may loose my job too but I still think the bailout is WRONG. Let these guys go under. Market forces will breed a new group that will take over where they left off and we will go through all this again in another 15 years. Remember RTC? Remember 1930's I have my money now buried in a green bean can in the backyard where it is safe. Have stocked up on beanie wienies and Budweiser. Let the games begin. Kev

Tuff decisions are not always popular. No to a bailout. Lets take our medicine and cure the ill. Ceo's get nothing! Employees need a little shelter. Not 2 trillion worth. I hope and pray that these fatcats get theirs in the lower posterior location! Vic

Who made the cheap money (to loan) available? Who put this crack-cocaine (cheap money) at the disposal of the financial markets? Who set interest rates artificially low in order to encourage, and reward, those lenders who responded by selling and distributing more debt? America's Politburo: The Federal Reserve. They aren't Federal and they have no Reserves. If you think you'll be hurt by *no* bailout, your pain will be much greater and of a far longer lasting nature after the bailout goes into operation. This would only one of other future such emergency bailouts and strategies. Short term market euphroia in exchange for a dollar that gets toasted to a golden brown in a matter of months. Then what will your money buy? The Fed has chosen monetary inflation as their primary tool now. They're doing their best to convince sheeple that it's the fault of the short-sellers or less-than-prudent lenders. That way, the sheeply will never focus on the genuine culprit. Nice job Benochio.

RON PAUL HAS TALKED ABOUT THIS FOR FORTY YEARS! IT'S THE FEDERAL RESERVE SYSTEM! Please INVESTIGATE THE ORIGINS OF THE unFederal noReserve brokenSYSTEM. The Federal Reserve Act was FRAUDENTLY PASSED BY ROBBER BARONS TO ROB OUR MONEY FOR THE PAST CENTURY AND KEEP US IN PERPETUAL WAR!

Ms. Casone, I just heard you on Fox. we need to allow this bailout or . . . "something dire is going to happen" . . .? I'll take dire over irresponsibility any day. It's time for a correction and it's time to pony up. Most Americans are not confused about this plan as you seem to think. They simply don't want it. Thanks

CC Please reconsider your comment that Mortgage brokers started this mess.Keep in mind that Brokers and Bankers that iniatiate loans ONly Make Loans they can sell to a secondary market ,which is where the loan criteria is developed.Go up the food chain until you can no longer find the value of a loan,and that is where the problem started. I am not involved in the RE market. Thanks

CC: My opinion is that the people you want to hear from are the ones to blame for this crisis. They, along with the crooks from Congress, are squarely to blame for this financial mess, but they really do not understand the proposed 'fix'. As a result they are not going to hang around for questions. Another group of fools is the American taxpayer. That group is comprised largely of individuals who are more concerned with the result of 'American Idol' than they are with the actions of Congress and the nationalization of American business.

Hey Cheryl, I agree with you on the state of financials in our country today. However, i disagree on your wish to hear more from those in charge of things. Every time President Bush, Secretary Paulson, or Chairman Cox speaks about our markets, something else bad happens. Maybe they should all just go away for awile and let the market take care of itself. Thanks.

I am convinced that there is a rarefied (thin) air around places like Wall Street and Washington, D.C. - its as if because everyone agrees that a thing is so and is a certain way, then it therefore is. And, since no other viewpoint or perspective is given credence - any other valuable insight and its resulting good judgment is lost. Things that would not make any good sense in light of the facts and factual reality anywhere else, make the rounds in Wall Street and Washington as if they are perfectly reasonable when they are not. Anything that differs from the way they want to believe it is and the way they all mostly agree it is - simply gets discredited, mocked and ignored. So, I thought about this and it occurs to me that if a person were looking at me and the house behind them was catching fire, would I really be concerned with convincing them of what they couldn't see was endangering them and whether there is a fire or a matter of my opinion about a fire or why I think there is a fire? Or would I just shove them out of harm's way and go put out the fire? Some things genuinely aren't a matter of rhetoric. Saying this is to say - we have people making decisions both in Wall Street and in Washington that have never bought their own groceries or had to make a choice between their car insurance and having the electricity bill paid. The rain never touches their heads, the pavement never touches their feet and ideas of what is what are constrained by the limited, rarefied environment where they exist. It makes Disneyland look real in comparison and more in touch with reality.

This whole financial mess only proves that the theory of evolution was correct after all,until now they could not find the :missing links: News Flash..missing links found in Washington and Wall Street.

UPDATE: Cheryl on my day off and I caught the reaction on your panal on this RTC sequel. Yeah,I call it a sequel. But honestly with goverment moving into the marketplace,a lot of scholors it seems like are questioning the fact that thier could be constitional issues that could be challenged in court. I was watching Glen Beck on Headline News last night to get gist of what was going on. Now get thsi: Rep Ron Paul saw this storm coming. He commented that the leadership of the hill hasn't approached but his fellow congressmen have told him off the record that he has been right along. Economist were throwing all sorts of theories out thier as to what's going to happen next. Now this morning what has strukc me is the marketplace confusion going on; Nero would be dizzy over the market action today; like oil shutting up to a 100 dollars a barrel and while the Dow rose 400pts. Now the shoe falls on Congress to see how they're going to contend and deal with this problem. But could incumbants of both parties be in for a rude awakening in November for mismanagement of finances?

Blaming short sellers for the decline and demise of investment banks makes for an attractive scapegoat. Stockholders and managers of firms, whose interests lie in higher prices for what they own or manage, miss few opportunities to deride short sellers. Short selling is a business widely unpopular with everyone who has a stake in seeing stock prices go up." Regulators, whose blunders short sellers frequently reveal by discovering fraud that escaped their attention, respond similarly. That combination of interests helps explain why, at various times, short selling has been banned in many countries, including England, France and Japan. Short selling is part of the information-revealing process that Mises, Hayek, and others emphasized as the central aspect and advantage of the market process. In a world of uncertainty and change, information is the scarcest good, and short selling is an important source of additional information that would otherwise be lost. There is no reason why information that might have negative implications for firms would be revealed to or discovered by other than those who are already owners of a particular stock. To attack or restrict short selling is then to restrict the market's ability to elicit and integrate all available information. Restrictions on short selling are analogous to a voting process where there are only the possibilities of voting yes (owning shares) or abstaining from voting (current non-owners), but "no" votes (selling what you do not own) are impossible. People can vote yes, buying shares and pushing up stock prices, or those who previously voted yes can decide to go back to abstaining by selling their shares, lowering stock prices. But short sellers allow current abstainers to vote "no," giving themselves the ability to benefit from their different views while benefiting others via market prices, without having to first own shares in a company. Allowing short selling increases the number of people with an incentive to discover valuable information about firms' prospects, by providing an added mechanism to benefit from information that turns out to be negative. When someone's research or information leads them to negative conclusions about a firm, short selling allows them to communicate their less optimistic expectations to others and make a profit if they anticipate the direction the market will later come to agree with. That is, they profit only if they come to "correct" conclusions before others. In the process, they benefit others by revealing accurate information sooner than would otherwise be the case, reducing the mistakes people would have made from relying on the less accurate prices that would otherwise exist. Regulatory opposition also indicates the positive consequences of allowing short selling. Regulatory agencies are supposed to prevent fraud, questionable accounting, and other management misbehavior. However, they often fail not only to prevent, but even to detect them. Short sellers who are betting their own money on being correct often uncover what regulators miss, as they did at Worldcom, Enron, Tyco, etc., showing themselves as more effective market policemen. Regulators then object precisely because their inadequacy is revealed. In fact, their often ineffective regulatory oversight makes markets less efficient, by giving participants more confidence in stock promoters' assertions than is warranted. But they try to make short sellers into scapegoats, allowing regulators to leverage their failure into further expansion of their powers, to combat short selling's supposed evils.

I also would have liked to have heard more from the President, but his substance-lacking speech was pre-planned. He (and everyone else) honestly do not know what really needs to be done, because the Feds have been sitting on their thumbs for too long. A last second bailout effort will give a short term boost to the market, but I think next week and maybe even the week after a significant profit raking sell off will occur and drive the DOW south again. Band-aids on deep wounds only conceal the true problem. Even a full scale bailout won't solve the underlining credit crisis, because their middle class and lower class is still reeling in overwhelming debt. And keeping their financing institution afloat will not fix this problem. I've always believed that simply eliminating or pushing back a debt only provides temporary relief and will actually build itself up into a larger disaster down the road. Federal relief is only lengthening the fuse that will ignite the credit crisis powder keg.

The stock market follows the economy. The economy has accumulated so much debt, that it can never be repaid. the world's central banks are attempting to stem the tide at the banks. will it work? This occurs every three generations in the industrialized world for the last 429 years. Please reasearch this yourself. you will notice the time intervals decrease over time, this is due to shorter life spans in the past.

FDIC is a joke. You know our government can't meet its obligations without printing money (and significantly devaluing it in the process). To mislead people into thinking otherwise is just dishonest. I figure it's only a matter of time before our debt holders cut their losses and trade their treasuries in for non default assets. I suggest to anyone reading this that you do the same with your dollars while they can still purchase real assets. America is addicted to credit. So do you keep on pumping in more smack to a herion addict to solve the problem, or do you cut them off? Of course not. So why do our policy makers keep piling on the debt? Because they don't want to go through the symptoms of withdrawl that would likely get them hanging from oak tree when the peasants (read the taxpayer) revolt.

Well I have my 44. Automagnum locked and loaded. I symphesized more with the employees than anyone else. I heard about the fear that has permenting the street while I watch some of Happy Hour last night. I wouldn't be surprised the tension is on the street. I bet New Yorkers haven't been hit with something like this before. But I don't blame them for the storms in the fincianal sector. Place the blame where it rightly belongs. Listen markets need investment banks. Investors need investment banks. It's an equastion that links. Well indicators are pointing toward Democrats in Congress. And maybe a few in the Republican party. But in the private sector I would blame management and Chairman's like Fuld of Lehman's Brothers for thier irrestobility. Lack of hinsight. And throwing money away from on bad paper. I'd like to know the WHY myself. Now Obama according Ed Schultz of Fargo ND he blames the lobbyists. Now I wonder how factual that is. Becouse Obama was silent on the AIG issue where McCain took a stand. Democrats bash Bush. Frankly they weren't good managers of the house and senate. Even they left today with thier hands in the air. How about have Senator Schumer get grilled by these consutitents in the banks who maybe loosing thier jobs. Frankly corporate managers and congressionals need a real an economic check. Seriously.